Theme for discussion ...

[Андрей Захаров]

I would like to discuss this topic here .... especially regarding the “development of standards for services in the field of private investigation” .... I personally can’t imagine how these standards can generally take place in our activities .... Also not I can imagine what actions can be taken to create some kind of information bases for BH (in general, some kind of absurdity ... given the fact that virtually all the information resources that BH basically use are actually open to general access .... Another thing is that not everyone knows about this)))))) .... Maybe someone has some opinions in this direction .... Simply, based on the fact that there can be no "standards", then all is lost the meaning of all these clearly far-fetched “initiatives” from individuals who supposedly “represent” our interests ... the interests of working BH .....

On February 9, 2016, the IV All-Russian meeting of the Non-State Security Sphere (NSS) was held under the slogan: “NSS-Keepers of Russia! Russia-territory without danger ”as part of the XXI International Forum“ Security Technology ”held in Crocus Congress Hall, Moscow.
The event included:
- Chairman of the RF Federation Committee on Defense and Security Ozerov V.A.,
-Deputy of the State Duma of Moscow, Chairman of the Security Commission Svyatenko I.Yu.
- members of the Committee on Security and Anti-Corruption of the State Duma of the Russian Federation, deputies A. Lugovoi and Kostunov I.E.
- Chairman of the Board of the Association “KC ROSS”, Secretary of the Constitutional Court on cooperation with private educational institutions and private detectives at the Ministry of Internal Affairs A. Kozlov
- Deputy Chairman of the Constitutional Court of the National Security Council of Russia D.E. Galochkin
- President of the All-Russian Public Organization “Association of Private Detectives of Russia” S. Lyubimenko Topic: “Development of the institution of self-regulation in detective work. The need to create a professional private detective standard.
And many other representatives of international security in various fields.

Following the meeting, a resolution was adopted regarding part of the detective work -
In order to develop the market of detective services:
1. Continue work on the development of legislation aimed at creating conditions for the favorable development of the market for detective services.
2.Activate the work on the formation of a positive image of private detective work by improving the quality of detective services provided.
3. Continue to improve cooperation with law enforcement agencies in the prevention and disclosure of crimes, the prevention and suppression of administrative offenses.
4. To work out the issue of creating an information base for private detectives.
5. To work out the issue of returning to the current legislation of Russia, the norm authorizing private detective activity by a legal entity.
6. Proceed to the development of a standard of high-quality detective services.
7. Proceed to the development of the foundations of self-regulation in the field of investigation.

https://iapd.info/blog/iv-vserossijskoe-soveshchanie-negosudarstvennoj-sfery-bezopasnosti-1.html

 

[Группа К]

Andrey Valerievich raised a good topic!

The introduction of standards in my opinion is a necessary thing and is not limited to information sources about which everyone already knows. This is primarily the standards of the rules for the provision of search services to consumers. For example, a detective can carry out activities to verify the reliability of the customer’s counterparties. But how to check it, what to look for when checking, what should be avoided, how to draw up a report ... all this is not. Hence the many different opinions regarding the rights and obligations of the detective.

In fact, private investigation is the only and youngest profession that does not have a methodological basis. The state investigation has it, but we do not. Terminology, definitions, methodologies, recommendations, etc., etc. Yes, there is much more that, in addition to business reliability, it is necessary to bring to a common denominator.

In general, I think this is a very important step. But it seems to me that while those people who are ill with a private investigation, while detective practitioners will not participate in such events, nothing will change. It will end with the creation of an SRO (by analogy with expert communities), with the need for a detective to pay mandatory membership dues to this SRO.

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Advertising)) About the methodology for checking the business reliability of legal entities can be found on my forum in the "Search Audit" section.

 

[Матушкин Андрей Николаевич]

Here are the responses to the article and the event itself from the social. networks:


Gennady Sobol Question - and for whom is this done? Here I personally do not need a single paragraph of their resolution. They want to create an SRO and collect money from detectives? I don’t see another goal!


Dmitry Ivanov Of course, they want to withdraw money. But seriously, it would make sense to develop a standard for documenting detective work - in terms of reporting the results of the investigation, our BHs are inferior even to the Ministry of Internal Affairs, and this is a low standard.


Gennady Sobol Dmitry Ivanov If you create any standards, tomorrow they will take off three skins for not meeting them. And not the fact that these standards will not bind us completely. The results of investigations do not depend on any patterns, but on the powers laid down in the law, and on the experience and education of the detective himself. As for me, I don’t want to compete in anything with the Ministry of Internal Affairs. My reports quite suit my customers, otherwise they would not pay me money.


I agree with Gennady ... and regarding the presentation of the results ... there are two documents ... a report and an act of acceptance of work ... the latter is mandatory in accordance with the law ... the form is arbitrary ... and this is not a standard for the provision of services .. .a just a document confirming its implementation ...


Evgeny Schepin In my opinion, it is necessary to take into account the many years of experience of foreign countries in expanding the rights of detectives. I do not agree with the very wording of the question of creating specialized databases. It is not advisable to raise the question of creating your own databases, which will require investment investments, and obtaining admission (with appropriate restrictions) to existing bases on a reimbursable basis. Budget revenues will be more convenient for supervisors. And this is not one issue that has been resolved in the United States a long time ago, but we still cannot.


"Dmitry Ivanov Standards are not always requirements, but rather, on the contrary, a way to raise the general culture of providing services, communication with clients and authorities. I will give you a simple example from another industry. When you arrive at the hotel you can be sure that the room has toiletries, a minibar , slippers, etc. But in detective services there is no such standard, even in the same USA you can run into an accurate report on the work done with a clear costing, description of sources and copies of documents, and the answer in the format "here is the result, enjoy and pay "."


"So that’s the question, that in the case of CWD, when rendering a specific type of service, for example, collecting information on civil cases (this is just an example), you cannot completely prescribe the rules on how and how to collect information on this particular order ... and the presence of these rules is the standard ... and the conversation here is not about the order and form of processing the results of work, but about the order of execution of the order itself ... but such rules (universal) cannot be developed in principle .... such rules may exist, for example, in construction, where everything is regulated by the same Construction Norms and Regulations, for compliance with which it can also monitor SRO ... and we are not builders smile emoticon smile emoticon and we do not and cannot have standards similar to SNiP .... "


"Dmitry Ivanov And here I agree not 100%. Indeed, to regulate exactly what and how to do it within the framework of the investigation is utopia. On the other hand, if the services that provide the black hole are really services, rather than shamanistic dances, where everyone has his own way of communicating with higher powers, the client has the right to rely on a certain level of communicative culture and the quality of the presentation of the final and intermediate results. after all, not all requests are of such a nature. Often the work comes down only and exclusively to the collection of information, and here fornication sometimes occurs. whether it’s really located at the specified address, take some photos and begins “Should the photo be a time stamp? "," How do you describe the results of the departure? "," Do I need to write a report or can I just send pictures? ", and what reports sometimes have to be read - it's just a guard smile emoticon From Spain one licensed private detective sent me a photo made on a cell phone and a two-line report, they say, I swear by my mom, a good, working company. Having looked at such reports, I had long been sworn to just transfer tasks, and immediately I sent a document template with the requirements for the final result and the work process. Sometimes it helps. It would be good if there were standards for the design of information search results in open sources, clear indications of the reliability and completeness of the information arrays used, requirements (not formal, but observed) for video, audio and photo equipment, and there are still a lot of standards that would help put things in order industry, only nobody really needs that smile emoticon "

"Dmitry Ivanov Something I signed today, I'm sorry smile emoticon I need to work, but I do my best. I do not believe in the expediency of the existence of SROs in the detective industry. So many of these associations and unions have bred, horror, and how many more non-state unions and security advisory councils at the Central Internal Affairs Directorate, the Ministry of Internal Affairs, the FSB and other respected organizations; unions of business and competitive intelligence, support organizations for the veterans of the mentioned and other organizations (actually performing the same representative functions when interacting with the state) - what is the use of such unions and associations? and you can have a drink without a big name, clients for participation in such associations are "not maintained", the status is dubious at best - if you have a reputation and clients, there is hardly any time to sit and confer. "



"In principle, everything is quite simple ... for example, we practice drawing up a plan-task before concluding a contract, which is an integral part of the contract, which sets out options for both the task itself, its volume, and in what form the information can be provided, their the volume and various nuances of the execution of a specific task ... this allows you to clearly (if possible of course) formulate the task, as well as avoid various misunderstandings with the customer .... there is still much that can be foreseen ... there is a developed sample plan-task which is supplemented with taking into account a specific contract .... but again, this is not a standard .... besides this, the question of service standards is not such a simple question as it seems ... there are many different nuances that only practitioners who really work know ... and those people who actually declare something (as described in the article under discussion) actually never worked as a BH and they don’t know all this ... although these persons are officially "registered ovans "as a black hole ... smile emoticon ... besides this, you need to keep in mind the fact that only practitioners can prepare something sensible .... and for that (for free) hardly anyone will cook something ... with taking into account the fact that all this time ... And none of the initiators of all these "innovations" will pay for all these developments .... and, among other things, I still think that the standards in our activities are simply not possible taking into account everything what was said ... but this is a personal opinion ... smile emoticon on issues of "meetings" and reputation is not imposed on anyone and I completely agree and held the same opinion and I don’t believe in the possibility of SROs in our work ... for the reasons mentioned above smile emoticon "


“Dmitry Ivanov I wouldn’t admire the USA so much and especially France, if we talk about the quality of detective services. The USA has a well-developed methodology, you won’t run into the option“ I’ve been working as a district police officer for 10 years, we’ve swam-know ”; in France, no it’s worthwhile to work with detectives in general, it’s better to look for retired counterintelligence officers - the BH in France can go to the address and give an extract from public records, this is their limit. "


“Viktor Medvedev, 5 point already was: 5. To work out the question of returning to the current legislation of Russia, a rule allowing private detective activity by a legal entity. A good option for divorcing clients, and most importantly, there’s no one to ask, but everything is fine. First you need to deal with Legal entities offering services that fall under the NPV. As a non-legal entity or information agency, they are sheer spies and scouts. "

https://www.facebook.com/groups/717853031578249/

 

[Матушкин Андрей Николаевич]

At the moment I am not aware of the work done, but contributions in the amount of 5,000 rubles. already accepted for entry into the SRO.

 

[Виталий Климин]

4 and 5 points are necessary, the rest is water!

 

[Виталий Климин]

And at their SRO, let them collect from each other! Although there are a lot of suckers in Russia, the country is big, so look and get a million more for your salary!

 

[Детективное агентство ОПЦИОН]

I consider the standards completely nonsense, because it is with the client that I discuss what he needs. He will tell me that he needs it, and I will tell him "no dear, I will do this to you!" : lol:: lol:: lol:
All these SROs have already passed stages in other sectors, just collecting grandmas!
I consider all these meetings above to be complete nonsense. It’s not about them that Lenin said: “They are terribly far from the people ....: lol:: lol:: lol:: lol:: lol:: lol:" ???????

 

[Детективное агентство Тула]

Andrei Valerievich, dear colleagues!
Not so long ago an attempt was made to attract members of our Partnership to discuss and formulate amendments to the Law on BH and OD.
Is this approach number 2?

 

[Роберт]

Interestingly, how do colleagues imagine the procedure for obtaining and providing evidence in court? Or to the investigation? What needs to be done so that the court is guaranteed to recognize this as evidence in the process? Now the detective’s work almost does not correspond to the procedural norms. Well, this is understandable, there is no such thing, unlike a lawyer.

 

[Zhomart]

This topic is for our country, where there is not even a Law on Private Investigation is still far